Are we living in the End Times as defined by the Bible?
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| Started: | 5/10/2008 | Category: | Politics |
| Updated: | 3 months ago | Status: | Voting Period |
| Viewed: | 262 times | Debate No: | 3977 |
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (36)
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It is my belief that we are currently living in the Last Days, as described in various parts of the Bible. Proof of this argument lies in the prophecy and infallible word of God which describes certain events that will take place in the end times so that persons living in these times will know that it is indeed near the end of the world.
Anyone wishing to debate this subject must have an open mind and understand that events unfolding around the world have a tinge of fear and birth pangs of a new world order coming to fruition setting up the political stage that will usher in the False Messiah or leader who will lead many astray.. Dare you debate me??
Although my biblical knowledge is not as strong as some, I'll take you up on this debate. Although, I must say that you have left me very little to argue against so...I will continue on to my points. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1)Jesus warned us about a false rapture when He stated: Matthew 24:26 If ever therefore, they might say unto you, Behold, He is in the desolate place; DO NOT GO forth: behold, [He is] in inner chambers; believe [it] not. Therefore, there is no end of time, just false raptures set forth by people like you. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) The Signs: Matthew 24:29 "But immediately after the tribulation of those days THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED, AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT, AND THE STARS WILL FALL from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. Currently, due to the lifetime of the sun, it is expected to be "Darkened" in roughly 4.5 billion years. Matthew 24:27 For just as the lightning flashes in the east and is seen to the very west, so will be the Coming of the Son of Man. There have been no indications of such lightning flashes thus far. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "Dare you debate me??" I do. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- |
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1. It is interesting that you choose this particular scripture because if you refer just above that to Matthew 24:7-8
You will hear of Wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. All these are the beginnings of birth pangs. This verse here describes exactly what is happening right now. 2. In addition, you have to understand what the word Rapture is. I have not mentioned this word, but you have accused me of conjuring up a false rapture. All I am saying is that we are living in the end times. Rapture is a totally seperate subject that is related to the end times. The rapture is the mass disappearance of Christians who are caught up in the air with Christ when the Trumpet sounds. Then after this event takes place the Tribulation will begin when all of God's final judgments will take place. The anitchrist or False Messiah will not be revealed until after the Rapture occurs. the events your talking about will come at the very end. The darkening of the sun moon stars, and the appearance of Christ as lightning from east to west. 3. The items your describing refers to the false christ and others who will come in his name,namely false christs and false teachers, people like: Jones, Barrack Obama, Manson, Paula White, Joel Osteen, John Hagee and others. 4. The real issue is what's happening to nation of Israel right now. The nation just turned 60 years old this week. prior to 1948 Israel hasn't been a nation for over some 1900 years. This has importance because the Nation of Israel is God's chosen people.God promised to gather his chosen people together again in the end times back to the land that he gave them. This nation determines where we are (the gentiles)and fit in Bible prophecy. if you refer to Luke 20:21 Jesus says: When you see Jerusalem being surrounded by armies you know the time grows near. The bible also describes other events that will hasten the coming of the end of the age Jesus said that society will become increasingly lawless and immoral as the time approaches for His return. In fact, He said it would become as evil as it was in the days of Noah (Matthew 24:12,37-39). 5. The book of Daniel says that there will be an explosion of knowledge in the end times and that people will move about quickly (Daniel 12:4). There are many Bible prophecies that cannot be understood apart from modern technology. For example, how can the whole world look upon two bodies lying in the streets of Jerusalem (Revelation 11:8-9)? Modern television satellite technology makes it easy. Looka at all the tremendous increases in knowledge and you can clearly see that we are fast approaching what some would call a very scary moment in our history if not for the sake of the Christs return for his saints. Other significant signs of Israel that we are told to watch for in the end times include the re-occupation of Jerusalem (Luke 21:24), the resurgence of Israeli military strength (Zechariah 12:6), and the re-focusing of world politics on Israel (Zechariah 12:3). All these signs have been fulfilled in this century. The nation has been re-established, the land has been reclaimed, the ancient language has been revived, the Jews are back in Jerusalem, and Israel is the focal point of world politics. Jesus says in Luke 21:28 that when these signs begin to happen, we should "straighten up and lift up our heads" because "our redemption is drawing near." His prophecy is contained in the fig tree parable (Matthew 24:32-35) which He presented in His Olivet Discourse. The day before He delivered this speech, He had put a curse on a barren fig tree, causing it to wither (Matthew 21:28-29). This was a symbolic prophecy that God would soon pour out His wrath upon the Jewish people because of their spiritual barrenness in rejecting His Son. The next day Jesus reminded His disciples of the fig tree. He said to watch for it to bloom again. In other words, He said watch for the rebirth of Israel. He indicated that when the fig tree blooms again, He would be at the gates of Heaven, ready to return (Matthew 24:33). Equally significant, He added an interesting observation: "Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place" (Matthew 24:34). What generation? The generation that sees the fig tree blossom. so it is obvious that you are sadly mistaken. I would hope that you take to heart what i have laid out here so that you can also enjoy eternal life think about it Hayslip forfeited this round. |
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I want to thank my opponent for the lively debate. I understand the difficulty in debating that we are not in the End Times. I mean look around you.
Hayslip forfeited this round. |
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Last I checked your putting in your two cents on my debate page.
Good Day Sir!
"I guess name calling will have to suffice for you"
-Do you really think I, or anyone reading our exchange is stupid??? What names have I called you? It is you that has continuously hurled insults at me (and others), including, but not limited to, within the context of our debate. Nice try...
"You can't pick and choose parts that you like and dislike when it best suits you and expect to make sense."
-I am not picking parts that best suit me- I am pointing out veracities and inconsistencies. YOU have failed as an adherent to religion to prove that I am wrong in any way. You have failed to correct inconsistencies, minsconceptions, and contradictions- which all I have done is point these out.
"Now your trying to get me to leave the web site because of what reasoning again?"
-I'm not trying to make you leave anything. I am pointing out the fact that you despise logical debate, and this is a debate website... need I be more clear as if you are a two year old??? The website is not compatible with your goals, so you can either leave or deal with DEBATING on debate.com. That is not rocket science. I can't join a website called "Jesus is God" and expect everyone to have the same beliefs I do when I don't even believe Jesus is God! Did you expect everyone on a DEBATE website to agree with you??? If so, why join???
"It's ok I'm praying for you"
-Now THAT is the greatest insult you have leveled against me. I doubt someone with your hateful mind, attitudes, and disregard for God's truth has any sort of communication with him.
"Only those who know Christ intimately will enter"
-Again, you are being a false prophet. This is nowhere in scripture, and it is a dictation of your own belief as if it is truth- false prophecy.
"Dang those pesky things keep showing up, now why would he say that if he wasn't God"
-You are obviously not content with your performance in our last debate because you keep bringing up these points I have already rebutted...
"Last I checked Monotheistic Agnostic Deists with Sugar on top don't go to live with Christ for eternity either, but that's just my opinion"
-Thank God! I wouldn't want to live with a dead guy!
CERN is not a secret, nor is what they do. I didn't learn this from you, and I didn't learn it by reading "Angels and Demons" (I previously attributed the mention of CERN to the Davinci Code, but it was it's predecessor that mentions it). CERN is not the only institution devoloping colliders, and this is very old technology who's progress is based on probability, so to be surprised and/or alarmed when they make progress is to be ignorant of their research in it's entirety.
"You make 50k-75k as a Biomedical Engineer"
-Yes. And so do about 75% of Biomedical Engineers.
"Must be some important work."
-A janitor does very important work and makes much less- so do teachers for that matter. Your insinuation is very elitist, and I am quite happy with my income.
"If your scared that's simply a byproduct of your concience and has nothing to do with me."
-Identifying fearmongering and being scared are hardly the same thing...
"When did I predict an exact day"
-I never said you predicted an exact day, I said your predicted a timeframe. If the "season of what is to come" spans two thousand + years, then you are correct... Paul agrees with you! Jesus will come while Paul is still alive... o wait... he's already dead! So when is he coming again???
"You want to debate scripture when it makes your argument look right and you want to discard it when it contradicts your point."
-If you have no scholastic approach to "scripture", then you are an example of what one would sound like. The different authors of the bible (there's 60 different books!) had various goals- one of them was to document actual events. The fact that some things are true and can be proven true in the bible, and others contradict themselves is not my failure
It's ok I'm praying for you, you should really try and read those sciptures I gave you so you can know Jesus for who he really is. Like you said, "not everyone who says Lord,Lord will enter the kingdom of heaven."
Only those who know Christ intimately will enter, meaning those that know who he really is, God in the Flesh!!
"I and the Father are one" -Jesus Christ
"If you have seen me, you have seen the Father." -Jesus Christ
Dang those pesky things keep showing up, now why would he say that if he wasn't God. Guess it just depends on who do you say Jesus Christ is?
Last I checked Monotheistic Agnostic Deists with Sugar on top don't go to live with Christ for eternity either, but that's just my opinion! I guess name calling will have to suffice for you.
"You will know the truth and the truth will set you free."
-Jesus Christ
Next you'll claim to be some sort of professional Church Goer, oh wait you already clamed to be that.
"Scientific doesn't scare me, as it scares those who don't understand it (like many forms of bigotry). The fact that an organization designed to pioneer scientific discoveries is making scientific discoveries is not startling- it's common senseScience doesn't scare me"
- Who is trying to scare anyone? If your scared that's simply a byproduct of your concience and has nothing to do with me.
"When someone predicts a timeframe for something that is not explicit in the bible, when it has been predicted in the past to no avail, and when countless others have claimed to have special knowledge and understanding of prophecy- you are a false prophet in attempting to predict a precise timeframe for something the original prophet states (Jesus) noone..."
- When did I predict an exact day or hour that the end was coming? All I did was identify this time period as the season of what is to come. Which in no way contradicts the bible or Jesus. I never said "On Wednesday May 14 at 11:19p.m. the world will end." Quit putting words in my mouth. Your the one that wanted to take on my argument using the tools that i laid out as the bible and then change the debate midstream
You want to debate scripture when it makes your argument look right and you want to discard it when it contradicts your point. Either it is the inerrant infallibe word of God or it isn't. You can't pick and choose parts that you like and dislike when it best suits you and expect to make sense. You might as well be Mormon if your going to do that. Sorry Mormons
-You haven't explained how that has anything to do with the "end times". I am not an idiot- I accept this as scientific progress. Scientific doesn't scare me, as it scares those who don't understand it (like many forms of bigotry). The fact that an organization designed to pioneer scientific discoveries is making scientific discoveries is not startling- it's common sense. As for "keeping watch"... keeping watch for what??? Why should anyone be anxious for "the second coming" (if you believe in that) when Jesus claims everyone will know when he comes???????? Why should I be "ready" if that is not the "final judgement"????? I fear God, and noone(thing) else.
Yes- I am a Biomedical Engineer with "some" college. I was trained in the Army as an Intelligence and Electronic Warfare Systems Repair Technician, and then as a Biomedical Engineer. Do your research and you will find out my schooling was better than any college can offer, and that "military equivalent" is more than sufficient for most positions in my field requiring a degree. ;) I'm not saying this to brag, but since you brought it up in an attempt to attack me with it...
"I'm not claiming to be a prophet, you are labeling me that because of your lack of observation and investigation in to the real events surrounding the world's present circumstances."
-When someone predicts a timeframe for something that is not explicit in the bible, when it has been predicted in the past to no avail, and when countless others have claimed to have special knowledge and understanding of prophecy- you are a false prophet in attempting to predict a precise timeframe for something the original prophet states (Jesus) noone- not even he- will know the hour. As far as the wars, rumors of war, and tribulation- that is subjective. This was prophesied to Jews- who at this moment in time are under no tribulation. Like I said before- even Paul assumed he was living in the "end times". If course I am not questioning whether or not God has actually sent you- if you admit to being a prophet then a different test applies, but you have not done so. Since you stake this belief on your own interpretation of what the authors thought to be their own time, then you must be more intelligent than Paul, right? More observant maybe? Maybe you should redirect those insults to him!
Only a fool says in his heart there is no God. Do your due diligence before you start dropping the name calling and senseless attacks. And if you were really a Biomedical Engineer you would understand the seriousness of my claims.You would know about transgenics, the singularity, the new Hadron Collider starting up at CERN in Switzerland and other important factors that identify the season of when the end times will come. You are so caught up with winning arguments you are not keeping watch.
I encourage you to truly open your eyes and look around you before you make your foolish assumptions.